Difference between revisions of "Mars One"
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* Emergence of technical, legal or organizational problems of Mars One with subsequent financial breakdown | * Emergence of technical, legal or organizational problems of Mars One with subsequent financial breakdown | ||
* Decline of [[public interest]] and slump of viewer levels | * Decline of [[public interest]] and slump of viewer levels | ||
| + | |||
| + | ==Collection of Technical Details from Torben== | ||
| + | |||
| + | These items are copies from the thread "Mars One Leaks" on marsonefans.com, published by Torben, who claims to be involved in the Mars One project. | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===06-08-2014, 10:11 AM=== | ||
| + | This thread is meant to leak technical details of Mars One. I (Torben) am involved in the technical part of the Mars One organization, which gives me access to most technical concept papers. There is no special restriction to the information I am going to give you, so I am pretty sure that what I am doing here is not in conflict with the internal Mars One regulations. However, I will not leak documents, schedules, financial details, data about persons (including myself) and business partners. | ||
| + | |||
| + | I have been reading this forum for a while, and I have the impression that there is great confusion about what is technically possible, viable and planned by Mars One. You may asks questions in this thread, and I will give answers according to what information is available to me. Please go into detail. The more detailed the question, the more detailed the answer will be. | ||
| + | |||
| + | To get started I am going to pick one of the often discussed questions ... | ||
| + | |||
| + | |||
| + | ===06-08-2014, 10:13 AM=== | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Question:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | ''How exactly will the colonists fetch water and fertilizer from the Martian soil for food production? | ||
| + | '' | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Answer:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | We must distinguish two processes: | ||
| + | |||
| + | First there is the everyday life support. | ||
| + | The food will be grown by hydroponics. Every wastewater is fully recycled and reused in the hydroponics and for drinking. Recycling is possible with the help of bacteria in a bioreactor, resulting in "salty" water. Fresh water for drinking is produced by partly freezing the salty water (the ice crystals are pure water) or by condensation of air humidity on a cold surface. No or very little additional water or other substances are required to be fetched from the Martian environment. | ||
| + | |||
| + | Second there is the expansion of the colony. This requires additional water, minerals, carbon, ore, building material. We have successfully tested the extraction of water vapor, carbon dioxide and minerals (dust) from a low pressure gas. Our plan is to use this method for adding small amounts to the internal biosphere. For the expansion of the colony's buildings we will collect dust and fine rock debris. | ||
| + | |||
| + | |||
| + | ===06-08-2014, 11:55 AM=== | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Question''': | ||
| + | |||
| + | ''1. What method is used to prevent colonists being contaminated with poisonous substances (like heavy metals) from the Martian soil inside the habitat?'' | ||
| + | ''2. Secondary to the first question : how is prevented that this poison gets into the plants which are used for food?'' | ||
| + | ''3. How is made sure that the plants or other (micro-)organisms grown for food contain all the essential nutrients the colonists need (like cobalt for vitamine B12 or Omega-3 acids)?'' | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Answer:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | 1. The Martian soil used for building expansion is processed outside the living quarters. Another source of Martian dust is when people come back from an outdoor mission and undress from a space suit. We plan to mechanically clean the suits before entering the living quarters by a combination of vibration and vacuum cleaner. | ||
| + | |||
| + | 2. The existing data about the composition of Marian soil and dust do not reveal a substantial risk of being contaminated if used as soil for plants. In the early years of the colony we will produce food only in hydroponics, not on soil, so the Martian soil does not infiltrate the food production. | ||
| + | |||
| + | 3. Nobody can live pure vegan, that is a fact. Our plan is to grow a variety of insects for food, serving as a source of B12 and all other required substances that plants can not deliver. Additionally, a selection of substances will be part of every shipment. | ||
| + | |||
| + | |||
| + | ===06-08-2014, 01:00 PM=== | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Question''': | ||
| + | |||
| + | ''Mars One could however consider to use (all kinds) of micro-organisms (of which some can produce vitamine B12) instead of some insects. A healthy soil for plants to grow on usually contains all kinds of organisms (including insects).'' | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Answer:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | Yes, the use of biologically active top soil is planned for later development in the colony. Investigation is under way. Anyway, this is not trivial, as the biological long term stability of an artificial biotope could not entirely be verified so far. Remember the Biosphere II experiment, where some species got instinct and others multiplied. | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Question''': | ||
| + | |||
| + | ''Another unanswered question is then still how you make sure these organisms produce all the essential nutrients in sufficient quantities.'' | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Answer:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | Every person will be medically monitored. If deficiency of any kind is discovered, the selection of food may be adapted. The dietary supplements in stock will provide an immediate help. More and different food plants and other organisms may be shipped from Earth. The establishment of a healthy biosphere in the colony is a process with a close scientific supervision. This is impossible to achieve in only one step. | ||
| + | |||
| + | |||
| + | ===06-08-2014, 01:53 PM=== | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Question''': | ||
| + | |||
| + | ''I thought Mr Lansdorp had come to the conclusion that making bricks on Mars was not possible. How do Mars One expect to use the Martian soil for "building expansion"?'' | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Answer:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | For one thing, Martian soil will be used to cover the light-weight buildings with a loose layer. For another, there will be bricks, but not of the usual kind. It will be more like a plastic brick with Martian soil as an additive. The pieces of the soil are mixed with molten plastic, e.g. polyethylene. The exact composition is still under investigation. | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Question''': | ||
| + | |||
| + | ''Mars One usually quotes the life support system on the ISS when asked about the life support system they propose to use. The Paragon life support system conceptual design study was due to be submitted to Mars One around a year ago, was it? What do they have to say about life support system consumables, as the system used on the ISS can't be used beyond Earth orbit due to its reliance on the supply of consumables from Earth.'' | ||
| + | |||
| + | '''Answer:''' | ||
| + | |||
| + | The life support system of the ISS is not used for the colony. Consumables are considered as not acceptable any longer. Instead, a battery of bioreactors will be used to break down the organic material in the wastewater. In combination with the hydroponics this provides a closed loop for the water and food. Only energy is required to keep the cycle running. | ||
==References== | ==References== | ||
Revision as of 13:25, 13 June 2014
| This article is a stub. You can help Marspedia by expanding it. |
Mars One [1] is the first project to colonize the red planet with a precise planning. Intended as a manned one-way mission, the settlers will stay on Mars indefinitely. Started as a semi-autonomous colony, the plan involves sending enough equipment for the colony to become eventually independent from Earth.
The initial technology for food and oxygen production will be sent before the arrival of the settlers. Most of the life support technology will be similar to that one on the ISS. The colony will be powered by solar panels. Food will be grown in LED-lit greenhouses with hydroponics.
A possible location of the settlement could be the valley Utopia Planitia. It is not too far from the equator, so the sun can be used for power generation though the year, and it is far enough from the equator to reach areas with large amounts of subsurface water.
Contents
Unresolved Problems
What if the hydroponics appears to be biologically instable
Bacteria may develop in a different way in the Martian greenhouses, because the different gravity and the microbial depleted in-house conditions may have strange effects in the long run.
What if all missions after the arrival of the first four settlers are canceled?
The settlers produce their own energy and food, making them independent from immediate resupply missions. However, the photovoltaics and LEDs will cease to function after a few years. Will the settlers be able to survive in the long run? There are a few possible reasons as to a discontinuation of supply missions:
- Political or military interference from other countries
- Massive increase of orbital debris in Earth's orbit (accidental or intentional)
- Emergence of technical, legal or organizational problems of Mars One with subsequent financial breakdown
- Decline of public interest and slump of viewer levels
Collection of Technical Details from Torben
These items are copies from the thread "Mars One Leaks" on marsonefans.com, published by Torben, who claims to be involved in the Mars One project.
06-08-2014, 10:11 AM
This thread is meant to leak technical details of Mars One. I (Torben) am involved in the technical part of the Mars One organization, which gives me access to most technical concept papers. There is no special restriction to the information I am going to give you, so I am pretty sure that what I am doing here is not in conflict with the internal Mars One regulations. However, I will not leak documents, schedules, financial details, data about persons (including myself) and business partners.
I have been reading this forum for a while, and I have the impression that there is great confusion about what is technically possible, viable and planned by Mars One. You may asks questions in this thread, and I will give answers according to what information is available to me. Please go into detail. The more detailed the question, the more detailed the answer will be.
To get started I am going to pick one of the often discussed questions ...
06-08-2014, 10:13 AM
Question:
How exactly will the colonists fetch water and fertilizer from the Martian soil for food production?
Answer:
We must distinguish two processes:
First there is the everyday life support. The food will be grown by hydroponics. Every wastewater is fully recycled and reused in the hydroponics and for drinking. Recycling is possible with the help of bacteria in a bioreactor, resulting in "salty" water. Fresh water for drinking is produced by partly freezing the salty water (the ice crystals are pure water) or by condensation of air humidity on a cold surface. No or very little additional water or other substances are required to be fetched from the Martian environment.
Second there is the expansion of the colony. This requires additional water, minerals, carbon, ore, building material. We have successfully tested the extraction of water vapor, carbon dioxide and minerals (dust) from a low pressure gas. Our plan is to use this method for adding small amounts to the internal biosphere. For the expansion of the colony's buildings we will collect dust and fine rock debris.
06-08-2014, 11:55 AM
Question:
1. What method is used to prevent colonists being contaminated with poisonous substances (like heavy metals) from the Martian soil inside the habitat? 2. Secondary to the first question : how is prevented that this poison gets into the plants which are used for food? 3. How is made sure that the plants or other (micro-)organisms grown for food contain all the essential nutrients the colonists need (like cobalt for vitamine B12 or Omega-3 acids)?
Answer:
1. The Martian soil used for building expansion is processed outside the living quarters. Another source of Martian dust is when people come back from an outdoor mission and undress from a space suit. We plan to mechanically clean the suits before entering the living quarters by a combination of vibration and vacuum cleaner.
2. The existing data about the composition of Marian soil and dust do not reveal a substantial risk of being contaminated if used as soil for plants. In the early years of the colony we will produce food only in hydroponics, not on soil, so the Martian soil does not infiltrate the food production.
3. Nobody can live pure vegan, that is a fact. Our plan is to grow a variety of insects for food, serving as a source of B12 and all other required substances that plants can not deliver. Additionally, a selection of substances will be part of every shipment.
06-08-2014, 01:00 PM
Question:
Mars One could however consider to use (all kinds) of micro-organisms (of which some can produce vitamine B12) instead of some insects. A healthy soil for plants to grow on usually contains all kinds of organisms (including insects).
Answer:
Yes, the use of biologically active top soil is planned for later development in the colony. Investigation is under way. Anyway, this is not trivial, as the biological long term stability of an artificial biotope could not entirely be verified so far. Remember the Biosphere II experiment, where some species got instinct and others multiplied.
Question:
Another unanswered question is then still how you make sure these organisms produce all the essential nutrients in sufficient quantities.
Answer:
Every person will be medically monitored. If deficiency of any kind is discovered, the selection of food may be adapted. The dietary supplements in stock will provide an immediate help. More and different food plants and other organisms may be shipped from Earth. The establishment of a healthy biosphere in the colony is a process with a close scientific supervision. This is impossible to achieve in only one step.
06-08-2014, 01:53 PM
Question:
I thought Mr Lansdorp had come to the conclusion that making bricks on Mars was not possible. How do Mars One expect to use the Martian soil for "building expansion"?
Answer:
For one thing, Martian soil will be used to cover the light-weight buildings with a loose layer. For another, there will be bricks, but not of the usual kind. It will be more like a plastic brick with Martian soil as an additive. The pieces of the soil are mixed with molten plastic, e.g. polyethylene. The exact composition is still under investigation.
Question:
Mars One usually quotes the life support system on the ISS when asked about the life support system they propose to use. The Paragon life support system conceptual design study was due to be submitted to Mars One around a year ago, was it? What do they have to say about life support system consumables, as the system used on the ISS can't be used beyond Earth orbit due to its reliance on the supply of consumables from Earth.
Answer:
The life support system of the ISS is not used for the colony. Consumables are considered as not acceptable any longer. Instead, a battery of bioreactors will be used to break down the organic material in the wastewater. In combination with the hydroponics this provides a closed loop for the water and food. Only energy is required to keep the cycle running.
